Lydia Hallie 0:00 No, actually I hate when people say that, like, you never have to work a day in your life. If you enjoy your work, it's like no, what you end up doing is you end up always working because your hobbies also your work. So, yeah, you're always working, but it's not a bad thing. I love it. It makes me the happiest.
Tim Bourguignon 0:25 Hello and welcome to developer's journey. The podcast shining light on Developers Live from all over the world. My name is Tim Bourguignon, and today I received Lydia Hallie. Lydia is a 21 years old web developer, software consultant and international speaker, a course instructor and tech influencer with a great passion for coding. She codes and studies computer sciences intensively, mentors developers rights, technical content, and shares her passion for programming extensively on social media. Lydia, welcome to DevJourney. Thank you.
Lydia Hallie 1:04 This is a great bio. Yeah, I wrote this on my LinkedIn. Yeah, I noticed.
Tim Bourguignon 1:15 I need to take inspiration from somewhere. Yep. Funny. So let's roll back all the way to the beginning of your story. Sure. When would you say Did your passion for coding started in the first place?
Lydia Hallie 2:44 Not entirely first. So I graduated high school and I was still a bit lost. Because like everyone around me, they went to universities and like, No, it wasn't even a question. You know, like, you either became a doctor or a lawyer and you just went to the best universities and still hadn't. No idea what I wanted to do. Because I was always just like studying microbiology, I was really interested in that. And I wanted to kind of combine programming with biology like research. But I just took a gap year I was like, first before I like start bachelor, I don't want to just drop out, like, I want to make sure that I do the right thing. So this one, I moved to Sweden, just to kind of get away from everyone just kind of clear my mind. I find that what I want to do, and I applied to universities, but in the end, I was like, someone just told me like, you can actually do programming as a job like, did you know that I was like, I actually didn't know that I was just doing it for fun. And that's just when I decided to, you know, skip entire university, like, screw it. I don't need that. I just wanted to go to start this as soon as I could. And that's kind of what I did. Yeah, so it started a year after I graduated high school, but I was just making my own projects. In the meantime,
Tim Bourguignon 3:56 what was the reaction from people around you when you say, I'll just stop
Lydia Hallie 4:01 Like my friends, there's still like, one day you're gonna fail. Like, you didn't go to university that, like, it's just not possible to be successful without it. But luckily my parents were like, it's you like we know you can do it. So they were always very supportive and yeah, my family was great with that. So I'm really happy about that. Yeah, other people around me that are currently in university they're still they I just didn't really like it that you know, it was an option to just skip the entire thing, but I'm happy that I didn't do it. But this also social thing, right, like going to university it's not just getting that diploma. It's just the entire student time that I guess many people like, Yeah, I don't have
Tim Bourguignon 4:44 that. That was four years ago. was
Lydia Hallie 4:47 a This was in 2017. Yeah, so three years ago, so 3006
Tim Bourguignon 4:53 so so you're Yeah, so your friends are still studying? Actually they are I think yeah, I think I just finished their bachelor that I should probably catch up because I have no idea what they're doing. But yeah, it's hard maintaining friendships when you're all over the world in different time zones and always working. Yes, it is. Okay, so, so take us through this, this journey. Oh, did you? Did you start? How did you choose how to start? Um, where did you think you could start and didn't just take us take us through this own this this journey of yours?
Tim Bourguignon 6:05 Was it a no brainer for you to to apply for boot camp? Or?
Lydia Hallie 6:09 Well, I mean, yeah, like it's, of course quite pricey. And I had no idea because I didn't know anyone around me that ever went to a coding boot camp. I didn't even know that it existed. But it still it kind of gave me some, like, secure feeling like of course, I could just learn coding all by myself like I don't think like him yet that I needed that boot camp, but like it was a scary step to take because it's a lot of money. And I didn't know anyone that did it or succeeded. I was like, I just have to try it. So at least I have some kind of certificate, right? Because I was scared because I only had a high school diploma and nothing else. And if everyone around you is like, you're gonna fail without a diploma, you kind of get a no yes, scared, pressured to at least do something to get a certificate. But I mean, in the end, no one ever looked at my bootcamp certificate, they just looked at my project. So that was Building there the entire time. I'm not even following like the curriculum, I was just making my own stuff. And yeah, I don't know, it's all about, you know what you're really interested in. And like a boot camp is great, but it's all about just a product that you're building.
Tim Bourguignon 7:15 So what people care about you saying, expand a bit more on this? What was great from the boot camp? What what you really took off out of it? What didn't work for you? And maybe for some other people, and what do you think didn't work at all?
Lydia Hallie 7:29 Yeah, so this is a difficult question, because I don't want to like, say that boot camps are a total waste of time, because I know that many people are like going to a coding boot camp. I think the thing that I learned there was also just teamwork, like, it was the first time that I work together with people on a project, which I didn't have to do before because it was just my own projects. And you know, he didn't really have the version control issues or management issues, even agile and I think that's the thing that I really learned at my coding boot camp just to work together with people to communicate and to understand, like others other people's code. Because at my first job, that's, I think, what I struggle with the most just working, like in the same codebase with so many people was pretty difficult. In the beginning,
Tim Bourguignon 8:21 did you do anything special to to learn this?
Lydia Hallie 8:23 Yeah, this question is like, they're so difficult to answer. Because it's like, I feel like all of my answers will be so negative and I don't want to do that like, um, ya know, cuz, ya know, that that's, I can't even answer that. I don't know.
Tim Bourguignon 8:39 Okay, okay, let's, let's, let's get to the next. So, yeah, sure. You did you did this, this bootcamp and built your portfolio, I guess with some with some side projects and then getting your presence online, etc. And how is the first step then, as a new bootcamp graduate, go To the industry and starting as a as a contractor or searching for a job, how did you make this step?
Lydia Hallie 9:05 So while I was going to the boot camp, I already started, like posting on social media, just my journey cuz back then I was like, there was no one on Instagram or Twitter or anyone I knew that kind of shared their progress. I was like, I kind of feel lonely because I was the only younger person that I knew that was coding. And I wanted to like, make new friends. So I already started, you know, posting on social media and expanding my network that way. And then after the boot camp, after I graduated, I flew back to Sweden. I was 19 back then. And that's when I just immediately like, started applying for jobs in Stockholm back then. And I got so many job interviews, mainly because people were like, oh, you're like a 19 year old girl. And like you're so enthusiastic and passionate about this. And it's like so fun to see and everyone was so positive about it. It was actually like a great experience just going to all these companies and they were all just kind of like you're sitting there in a room full of like senior engineers that are like 40 years old, I don't know. And you're just there as this, like, girls, like, I have no idea what I'm doing here. But yeah, let me build this project, I can pass this test and like, I can show you that I know this, but it was definitely like, it was so scary the first time that, like, it kind of started becoming a game, right? Like, people, they think that you're, you probably cannot, like do it. Maybe you know, like some HTML or I don't know, and then you prove them wrong. And it became like an addiction. I was like, Okay, I want more job interviews. I'll prove you all wrong. But then I mean, eventually, I just like got a job was like, Okay, this is fine. I guess I actually have to work. But yeah,
Tim Bourguignon 10:39 that was fun. Did you have a choice between the oldest companies? And yeah, make a choice at the end? Yeah, to make this choice.
Lydia Hallie 10:47 I mean, it was really difficult for me to know like, what kind of because that was when I was at like a junior developer. So like, what's the best position for me or even maybe an internship because I was still like, I need some kind of senior mentor. I want to become really, really good at this, I want to be the best. But some companies I didn't know if I wanted to be part of a startup because you know, it's smaller, maybe you get more interactions with senior developers, or a bigger company where you can learn, you know, how to work in a bigger codebase. And the entire kind of management aspect, I guess. But I always knew that I didn't really want to work at a big company ever. Like I just, I don't want to be just a number working on a product that no one really cares about. It was like, I just yeah, I'll join a startup see how that is also just the entire startup? I don't know like culture. Yeah, and just, I don't know, I'm always like, try it out. If it doesn't work, I'll move on. Like I don't really overthink too much, which maybe should do, but yeah, I just kind of do whatever feels right. So far, it's worked out so
Tim Bourguignon 11:50 no, I would almost be ready to push back on this. I have a feeling you have sold a lot by all this way more than I did when I was 19. I didn't think about anything. And way more than most of the junior developers I see around me. You're very, very scrupulous about all this conscious about everything you are. Oh, yeah, you are doing and reflecting on it.
Lydia Hallie 12:14 Yeah. I mean, I guess it's really like, I kind of understand myself. Now, that sounds really weird. But like, when I was in high school, I was always like, studying just to get the best grades. I mean, eventually, I didn't have to because I didn't go to university, but still, like, I was always so focused on just understanding how I learned the best and how I prefer the best way. And I see so many people around me currently, you know, junior developers, or people that are new to the tech industry. And all they really want to do is maybe join Google or during Facebook. They didn't really have a clear goal. I think what they really want to achieve with their, like, tech, technical skills, I think and I've always just been like, I want to Do whatever feels right to me. And maybe it's not the best decision at the time. But if it feels right to me, that's all I really care about. And eventually, that'll make you successful. As long as you just feel good where you are
Tim Bourguignon 13:11 currently, this is something that you already discovered for yourself four years ago when you were still in high school. Was it something came recently?
Lydia Hallie 13:20 Yeah, I think I just kind of mastered the skill of understanding how to learn and just to optimize my time, which I think is the most important skill to have just understand your strengths and weaknesses and you can make the best decisions just knowing that just don't feel too peer pressured by the people around you don't feel peer pressured by what you see on social media when you should do because no one really knows and it's different. It's different for for everyone.
Tim Bourguignon 13:47 Oh, let's talk with people for a second. You say the the M word a few minutes ago would mentor you say that when Oh yeah. came out of high school. You were searching for or out of this boot camp. You were searching for company where you would find a mentor that could help you make those first steps. Where do you learn about mentoring at this relatively young age?
Lydia Hallie 14:12 I mean, I didn't really know if it was a real thing, right? I was just like, well, maybe there's a senior developer that could just, you know, teach me how to do it. But eventually, I figured out that senior developers are just so opinionated. Like, you actually shouldn't have them as a mentor, because you won't really learn anything. You'll just copy their, you know, opinions, which are often just based on not even like facts. But yeah, so that's when I figured out I just need I didn't need a mentor. I just needed to constantly constantly study learn on different platforms, be on different social media, because like, the people that have on my Twitter feed versus my Instagram feed for my LinkedIn feed are also different. And it's actually really fun to see everyone's like opinion on the same, like technology or yeah Think just technology from different people, different perspectives that will work well. So like different companies, some really big, some really small and that's the most important thing. Don't just like listen to one person.
Tim Bourguignon 15:11 Okay? So get a different panel of people pushing you in many different directions so that you make your own decisions and opinions on things.
Lydia Hallie 15:20 Oh, yeah, definitely. Like always do your research before you just copy someone's opinion. And then tweet about it. And then like, also give other people like, Yeah, whatever. I wouldn't like talk about Twitter now. But
Tim Bourguignon 15:33 we can talk about Twitter. Twitter is a fine place as long as you know what you're doing.
Lydia Hallie 15:38 Yeah, that's why I like barely ever tweet. It's just Twitter's so bad.
Tim Bourguignon 15:43 Didn't Ah, so well. No, no, no. Okay, let's let's go back in time a little bit. So you were considering which company to join if it shouldn't be a big company and maybe a startup? Probably a bit smaller structure with people You could inspire yourself with, yeah, what what did you decide on?
Tim Bourguignon 17:05 yeah, it was pretty fun. Do you always do this? Well, I don't know what's gonna be, but I'm gonna figure it out. Yeah, that's
Lydia Hallie 17:12 just my life. Like, my life is one big chaotic mess. But somehow it always like, it turns out just fine. I really like challenging myself. So I always do things that I don't understand yet. Like, when I work on a new project, I'm like, I have no idea where I even start with this, which is the best feeling cuz once I actually figure it out, like, once I finish it, like, well, I just did that, you know, I started this entirely new thing with technologies that I hadn't even heard of before I started my project and now actually built something that's also working. Like, it's like, I know, it's the best feeling, especially when it's like new technologies. So you know, that's also, you know, good for other clients. But yeah,
Tim Bourguignon 17:55 do you have an example in mind where this didn't go so well? No. How you reacted to it.
Lydia Hallie 18:01 Think about that. I can't really think of anything actually. No, I mean, I'm sure it did. But like, my brain just deletes that. Like, that's an awkward moment. We shall remember that. I mean, it's true. Like, I feel so many times, but I don't really see the failures as like, Oh, I failed, right? I mean, it seems like this just didn't work out for me. And I'll try to find another way. Yeah, so I guess it's really difficult to kind of define that. Yeah.
Tim Bourguignon 18:28 Yeah. Or you pivot on things and you find another way to attack the problem. Yeah. Then it's successful. And then you don't remember this. This this roadblock? You had all this, this short failure you so because you actually made it in the end, but it was not the idea. You had the beginning. So it doesn't feel like a failure.
Lydia Hallie 18:50 Yeah, exactly. But also when I find out or when I feel like something just isn't working. I won't waste my time just to make it work. Like if I feel that I really lacks some knowledge about stuff. I'll just ask other people like, just help me out. I won't like spend weeks and weeks trying to figure something out just to get that feeling of like, okay, but I did it like I'm still very time efficient.
Tim Bourguignon 19:13 Do you have some kind of metric for yourself how long you spend on the problem before before moving on? Or before asking or
Lydia Hallie 19:20 I guess my measurements were like, do I feel burnt out? If I do that I should probably stop. Like sometimes I have this big thing. And I just really don't know how to fix it. And I spent days just thinking thinking and I'm like, maybe I should like exercise or go outside. You know what other people say just like clear your mind, but that never works for me. I can't do it as so think about it. And then yeah, when I get the burnt out feelings like what am I doing? Like? You really start to question your overall ability to program that's when again, no, this is it. Like I don't actually want to feel bad just because of this task, right? Like someone else can do it. If I can focus on what I'm really good at, and maybe once the other person has a solution, I'll check it out and I can learn from that. But yeah, I always tend to get really stuck on something when like, I just can't figure it out. I just I need to fix it, but I kind of overdo that sometimes.
Tim Bourguignon 20:18 And how would you go about asking someone for help in such a such a situation?
Lydia Hallie 20:24 Oh, I'm totally okay with that. Like, always ask people for help. I Yeah, I definitely don't see that as a weakness. Also, when people reach out to me for help, I really like it because then I know that the other person is also just efficient with their time, like they don't want to waste their time. They're not to just like, proud of who they are, like, pride in the tech community is a bit annoying. Sometimes, like, you should just, you know, understand what you need to ask for help. And that's totally okay. It's not a lack of weakness, or, you know, you're not really understanding certain technology or, like you, so be very good programmer and ask for help all the time. It's like you Not even related.
Tim Bourguignon 21:01 So should I picture it this way? You just, you just, for instance, on on TypeScript, and you know, those two individuals that are really good in TypeScript and do you just contact them and say, Hey, do you have after half an hour, I'd like to do some rubber duck debugging with you just explained you what I'm doing right now. And maybe you're, you have an idea to unblock me and just you get on the call and Exactly.
Lydia Hallie 21:26 Like, you learn so much from that. And then the next time that you run into the same issue, you can solve it by yourself. And I mean, you still save days just trying to figure it out by yourself, just because you want to get that proud feeling or I don't really know what people do. But yeah, and I just reach out to people and ask them like very specific questions. That's a very important thing. Because when people reach out to me asking questions, and they're like, I don't understand this thing. And it's very vague, like I can't help you if you don't understand what you don't understand. So first, like I was just doing my research to make sure that I understand what I don't understand that sounds super vague, but I hope you're so unhappy.
Tim Bourguignon 22:05 Yeah. Yeah, did the difference between the the known unknowns and the unknown unknowns in this on the spectrum of foam understanding. And when you don't know how to articulate the question, or the problem that you have, you're probably not, not there yet. And any help that you will get will probably not get you to too far. Yeah, I totally get it to the year. Okay. So let's go back here, away from this tangent again. So you were this company doing TypeScript react? A bit of byton working working with big DS and and so on. Um, what happened?
Lydia Hallie 22:45 I actually have to think about that. So this was in 2017. What did I do? Oh, no, this was in 2018. Okay. Yeah, so I left that job after some months. I just wanted to know what it was like to start contracting and freelancing because I saw that many people started doing that. And I still wanted to travel around. I just can't really stay at the same location for a longer time. Like, when I'm somewhere for six months, I have to leave. I don't know, I just feel this pressure, like, like you're wasting your time, you need to see the world, you need to travel again. And that's when I started doing that. So I just started freelancing. This is already when I had like a social media following so it was pretty easy for me to find clients. And I just started traveling so that's when I started the entire like going from Airbnb to Airbnb every month. Just working. I was this
Tim Bourguignon 23:41 transition from working locally with a team and then traveling the whole time and I guess probably doing only remote work.
Lydia Hallie 23:50 Yeah, it was great. It was the best like I just can't work in an office. So so far I've had two office jobs and I just can't work in the afternoon at all. Like I just can't focus, I focus really well in the morning and the evening and the night, but not like during office hours. And it felt so bad because I felt like I'm in an office now. I'm just wasting their time because I may be working for like the 40% of what I could do. So what I did is an after work, I started working again, because it's like, this is why I focus so I was working, like all the time on, you know, like a product that wasn't even like mine, and also wasn't for clients, but like I was getting paid for it. So once I started contracting, it was the best because I could just work in the morning and then night in an evening and in the afternoon. I could just do whatever I wanted, which is mostly just building my own products or watching courses or like going into nature, I guess. But yeah, I definitely just like being way more efficient with my time was the best change which I made as a contractor.
Tim Bourguignon 24:57 Could you pinpoint the the The traits, the the mindset, the typical mindset you have, or the typical mindset. I don't know if it's typical typical that you have that makes you as a remote worker, successful,
Lydia Hallie 25:13 like addicted to working, like many people are like, so what's your hobby, I don't have any edits. Sounds so sad, but I'm not like, it's just a bit. I'm always either thinking about coding or learning new things or writing about it. So when I work, I'm not really working. I'm just learning so many new things. And every project that I get every task, like introduces me to a new thing that I could maybe write about or help other people with, and maybe even like, build my own product on the side just doing that because I'm interested in, you know, the new technology that I just got introduced to. So yeah, I don't know. It's just like, it's just an exciting life to be a contractor if you're genuinely just interested in programming and want to do it also in your free time, kids. You basically never really have to work. Well, okay. No, actually, I hate when people say that, like, you never have to work a day in your life. If you enjoy your work, it's like no, what you end up doing is you end up always working because your hobbies, also your work. So, yeah, you're always working, but it's not a bad thing. I love it. It makes me the happiest.
Tim Bourguignon 26:21 I totally understand that you're always working. And you're having fun with just Yes.
Lydia Hallie 26:25 I mean, yeah. It depends on the day, because sometimes I'm like, so tired or burnt out and like, Oh, I don't have anything else in my life. Like, what do I do now? I just like read a book, or like, what do normal people do when they don't code? I don't know. Um, so then I end up coding anyway. But yeah, that's like the only downside. Probably, maybe it's good to have hobbies, but I keep on telling myself this, like, I should find a hobby, but I never really do it.
Tim Bourguignon 26:53 Kind of answers one of the question that was keeping for later, which was that you're all over the place. You're you're busy. But you're on YouTube, you're on your blog or on medium on dev the two on code mentor on GitHub. I get that explains a little bit now and I see.
Lydia Hallie 27:09 Yeah, so I do social media. I'm when I'm procrastinating as somehow it works. Like, I like write stuff. And people start following me on social media like great. I guess my procrastination is also somehow, like, good. Yeah. It's It's fun, though, to just, you know, see that so many people enjoy reading my content or they think that I'm inspirational for some reason. I don't know why, but it's Yeah, it's fun.
Tim Bourguignon 29:51 I think it is, it is, um, did you did you iterate on this a lot to get to this to this medium to this combination of mediums.
Lydia Hallie 29:59 Oh, no. I never really think about any of that. I just do it. And then I try it out and see if it works. And if it does great if it doesn't still great, like, whatever, it's not like I'm wasting my time or wasting money like, no, it's it's that Yeah, I'm just always doing whatever I feel like. And also, I kind of know, I understand what people especially on social media what they want. So I kind of sometimes change the content because I know like, these people want this, or they like this approach that like that approach. So I, I still think about just the best ways of like sharing content that people are actually interested in. But to be honest, I just kind of do whatever I want. And yeah, people seem to like it. So it's perfect that what I want to do is also what people enjoy doing. It's a it's by accident, but it's perfect.
Tim Bourguignon 30:51 Have you cleaned it? I was like, yeah, that's that's that's that's really cool. That's really cool. Congratulations on this. Yeah. Thank you. So I would like to call him to come back to you on to this mentoring piece. I think I saw I saw some I read somewhere that you are very active with mentees or on platform and really helping a lot of people a lot of the time. Logical this there was I have good boy, I don't remember where that where that was. It was number something I 10% at the same time that you regularly meet online or offline. Yeah. guide them on their journey. Yeah. How did you start with this and and how do you manage to to guide so many persons at the same time?
Lydia Hallie 31:39 Um, I think it started with that when people started to just reach out to me, they were like, Hey, can you help me with this thing? Like, sure I can help. But then I didn't really set up like an hour for them or like a certain time. Instead, I realized that they really enjoy just working with me they learn a lot from it. So I just started to accept more and more people and it was mainly just I mean, when you're like a mentor them, the thing that they need the most is just like psychological support, right? They just need to feel like they actually know what they're doing and that they're on the right track. And often it was people preparing for job interviews. And I know all that, like, I know how to pass these interviews now with like, the stupid questions like algorithms, data structures and the other questions. So I just helped them prepare for that. And then when they pass, it's the best feeling. It's like, Oh, I just helped this person get a job, like, that's great. Or just working together with them on a project. And maybe I just do code review. And it's a project that I was already working on. It's like, well, you're just like a free employee. Perfect. Perfect for like both parties.
Tim Bourguignon 32:42 Now, how'd you manage to have up to 10 persons in parallel?
Lydia Hallie 32:46 Oh, yeah. Um, so this was also when I was contracting. So like I said before, during the afternoon, I'm not doing like, or I'm studying or I'm just doing like my own stuff. That's kind of my free time. So that's, you know, six hours per day that I can just Spend, however I want. So it's pretty, like easy for me to just schedule them in those hours. And then in the morning, like I had already worked like eight hours and then an evening it would work again for like, eight hours. So, as productive, they're good. I like to spending my time you know, so helping other people makes me feel good and it prevents me from burning out because it's still like, you know, I'm also doing something good. I'm not just like coding all the time.
Tim Bourguignon 33:25 Yep. Okay, I see. I see. Makes sense. Yeah,
Lydia Hallie 33:28 but it was definitely like intense like, I stopped doing it for now just because I'm, I don't know, I felt like I had to take a step back. It was just too much. But I might start doing it again pretty soon. Yeah. It's fine.
Tim Bourguignon 33:43 Have you had such such ups and downs in motivations through which he had to pose a large piece of your of your life and just concentrate on work and then and then take more work again and then and then pose it? Yeah.
Lydia Hallie 33:57 Oh, I really I'm so bad at saying no to things like, I always say yes. So like, I have so many tasks when people ask for more and more, and they're like, Sure, I'll do it. I guess like I said yes to this. And maybe six months ago when I didn't have so much to do. And now everything's just piling up. And sometimes it's really difficult for me to stay motivated when I'm working kind of like in parallel and so many things like I kind of want to serialize my work to like, do one task, finish it, do another one to finish it, but that's just in my life. It never works that way. I'm doing like, currently, I may be doing six things at the same time. And people are currently asking me for like one task to like, finish it. And then there's an entirely different thing that I actually need to work on. And it's so chaotic, and that's when I may lose motivation, because it's just like I feel stressed out. I feel like there are so many things that I should be doing and I'm not paying like a full attention to it. So probably it's not for me not so much like taking a step back or like working less. It's just focusing more on one thing, and not so many things at the same time. But I mean, I'm still learning. Like, I'm still making so many mistakes, but it's fine. I learned from them.
Tim Bourguignon 35:09 Um, do you have a particular routine? in things that you learn something you do every day?
Lydia Hallie 35:16 No, I don't, I don't have any routine. I always try that because I see that like, successful people, like run every morning and do this. And then I tried for maybe three days and like, no, it just doesn't work. Especially now because some days are worse, like 4am and sometimes I or I'm already in bed like 9pm like my days are always very different. Like timewise so no routines just don't work for me at all. I just do whatever feels right. Which Yeah, it's like, yeah, I keep on coming back to that. But it made me really lame because people ask me like, oh, how can I you know, be like you. I'm like, I have no idea. I'm just kind of living. I don't know. I don't follow certain things. I have no idea.
Tim Bourguignon 36:00 I think it's normal to try to deconstruct what successful people do. Yeah. But it's it really seems to be a trend in what you do is really trusting your guts, and you'll get seems to be very, very wise. So, go with it.
Lydia Hallie 36:16 Yeah, you could just like, respect yourself, you know, like, don't just follow other people because you think that you can live their life like, that's their life, it's not yours. So you should just try to shape that you in the way that could be like in their life, but just try to find the strength within you that could lead you there. But you'll never be that person. You'll never have that successful life, but you'll have your own version of that. So just understand, like how you can get there and not just follow them because they didn't do that successful people didn't follow anyone. That's not how you get successful, right or happy? Like, yeah, I feel that's the main thing that I see in the tech world. They just try to copy people try to find success that way and it never worked.
Tim Bourguignon 36:57 I would like to flip it on its head just just as thought experiment. And so cooking people is, is is a way to get I think short, short term success or very an easy quick win. But on the long term, I think it doesn't necessarily really work. But you flip this on its head, if you really try to be yourself and whatever people around you say, you just follow your own path. Is this a more likely way to succeed?
Lydia Hallie 37:26 I think so. But I mean, you can still kind of change yourself, right? Like you need to if you feel like more comfortable, never working being super lazy and doing anything. Yeah. I mean, no, you won't get successful that way. But you still just have to understand what you're actually like, what you're actually passionate about, and not just like, Oh, I'm coding because I can get lots of money right now. And it's like many jobs. I mean, it's fine, maybe for the short term, but I don't think that you'll ever be happy or successful just doing that, but they're always things in tact and you can do that I'm sure everyone is passionate. About. And I think you'll never burn out working hard on something that you actually believe in, like, a burnout just doesn't happen from working hard. It just, it happens from working on the wrong thing. And like, you're when your goal is to be happy or successful. But by doing stuff that you don't enjoy doing you, you'll never get there. Like even then maybe you'll reach the end. And it's like, oh, man, this isn't what I expected. You have to maybe start all over again. It's like, yeah, so people see success or happiness is like a goal, but you'll never get there. It sounds so depressing when I say it that way. If it's not this is like the entire path should be success and happiness. It's not just a goal.
Tim Bourguignon 38:45 Amen. Yeah, very, very cool. Very cool. Where did you see your journey going in the next?
Lydia Hallie 38:54 I have no idea. I don't even know what I'm gonna do like an hour after this podcast. I never plan anything others see where it goes. Like, sometimes people just email me like, Hey, wanna have a call? It's just like something. I'm like, Sure, I'll do that. See what happens. But uh, I don't know. I don't plan anything ever. So it's really hard for me to say, yeah, we'll see.
Tim Bourguignon 39:16 Did you ever saw I want to continue pulling into this? Do you have a special field you would like to work on or something? I don't know if it's climate change if it's not something for the year or something for the something you want to move. So something that really burning in you say at some point, I want to move this thing.
Lydia Hallie 39:40 Maybe more into cybersecurity. I was trying to do that last year. I'm really interested in that. But I don't know it's scary. That that's still scary stuff for me to take is I have no idea how you can even get into that without university degree because this is some this isn't one of these check, you know fields Partha, here, we still need a degree for I think. But yeah, I just want to learn more about that, see if it fits me, maybe it doesn't. And I'll just move on, and I'll find something else. with climate change. That's what I wanted to do first. It's like, I want to work for a startup that, you know, helps reduce climate change and all that. That. Yeah, I don't know. It's not a goal that I really have. Yeah, this is just one of the things I'm like, it'll never work just to, you know, join a company that does something that you think you believe in. But in the end, it doesn't work. Like, I don't know. It's just do whatever feels right at the time. And we'll see. Well see. I'm very chaotic. I know I'm sorry. This is just me.
Tim Bourguignon 40:47 No, that's that's really cool. It's really interesting to see. I'm amazed I'm amazed. absolutely amazed. So let's let's let's throw a curveball at you. And if you could travel back in time, and meet yourself at 16 when you were starting to code, yeah, what would you say to yourself?
Tim Bourguignon 41:44 Pretty okay. I think you did as well. That's pretty cool. That's pretty cool. Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. If the listeners wanted to start the discussion with you and knowing that you will not say no and To grab you for a coffee or for a debugging session, where should they reach out to you?
Lydia Hallie 42:07 Well, you could reach out to me on Instagram, but I really bad at answering my direct messages. But I'm more on Twitter, you can always reach out to me on Twitter or LinkedIn or email is where you can find me or maybe Instagram maybe I'll see their message and I'll respond but yeah, I'm really bad at being active on social media, actually.
Tim Bourguignon 42:28 Yeah. Which is weird because you actually very active But well,
Lydia Hallie 42:31 I post things but I never like browse my feed. Oh, okay.
Tim Bourguignon 42:34 Yes, I see the difference. Yeah. Okay, um, knowing that you didn't plan anything for the future. Do you have anything coming up? conference dogs or an E book or special course coming up or videos, something you want to plug in?
Lydia Hallie 42:48 I do, but they're not confirmed yet. So I don't know to say anything about it. On my social media feed, if I if I do okay,
Tim Bourguignon 42:58 yeah, that would be my next question. Where can people see this when they confirm? So that would be on the social media? You will? Probably at that point. Okay, awesome. Awesome. Yeah. So or Twitter or LinkedIn or Instagram? Yeah. So we'll add the few links we mentioned in the show notes. And we'll link to your blog and willing to see if your articles that that there's online of you and this euro does that draw. And yeah, that's been fantastic talking to you. Thank you very much.
Lydia Hallie 43:26 No problem. Thanks for calling.
Tim Bourguignon 43:27 And this has been another episode of developer's journey. We will see each other next week, bye. All right, this is Tim from a different time and space with a few comments to make. First, get the most of these developer's journey by subscribing to the podcast with the app of your choice, and get the new episodes automagically, right when the air. The podcast is available on all major platforms. Then, visit our website to find the show notes with all the links mentioned by our guests, the advices they gave us, their book, references and so on. And while you're there, use the comments to continue the discussion with our guests or with me, or reach out on Twitter or LinkedIn. Then a big big THANK YOU to the generous Patreon donors that help me pay the hosting bills. If you have a few coins to spare, please consider a small monthly donation. Every pledge, however small counts. Finally, please do someone a favor, tell them about the show today and help them on their journey.